Road Traffic Collision Enquiry

Rain Monkey · Guru

Road Traffic Collision Enquiry

tomh · Guru

wonder if it was actually a motorcross bike or a trail bike as very few horse riders spot the difference!

Fixer · Tribune

I have responded to the e-mail and asked them to contact Cornwall TRF and the KTRC who may know more.
I've also suggested that the bikes may not have been legal which is perhaps why they didn't stop?

Fixer · Tribune

I received a very rapid reply to my e-mail to the PC concerned regarding this incident. My original e-mail to PC Powell is below.

Andy

Thanks for your prompt reply. The rider of the horse suffered minor bruising and discomfort. 
The horse bolted off but was not injured and made its way back to its yard.
I appreciate my chances of locating the rider to be slim. I have not singled out your club
and only enquired to try and identify the riders as you are interested in the same outdoor pursuit. 
I have E-mailed all the local trail rider groups as you have listed below. 
I am unsure what style of motor bike it was and understand the differences between motocross and trial bikes.
I am pleased your club has a code of conduct that ensures safe riding and respects other trail users.

Kind regards
PC 6338 Powell

-----Original Message-----
From: Andrew E Lander Stow
Sent: 16 February 2010 22:42
To: POWELL Craig 16338
Subject: Log 726 14/02/10


Hello

I read your e-mail that you sent to the TVTR (Tamar Valley Trail Riders)
and I'm concerned about several things in it.

The first, I hope the Horse and Rider are OK and are not put off by the
behaviour of two 'errant' riders. I call them errant as ALL of the Tamar
Valley Trail Riders adhere to the Trail Riders Fellowship Code of
Conduct. If it had been a TVTR ride then the leader would have stopped
when the horse/rider were spotted and indicated those following should
stop and kill their engines until the horse/rider had passed. So, you
may discern that the riders were not TVTR riders nor were they TRF riders.
Secondly you state they were 'Motor Cross' (I believe you mean
MotoCross) riders. MotoCross bikes are not usually road legal. Did the
bikes have number plates?
ALL of the rides we carry out are advertised on our Forum which can be
found at http://tvtr.activeboard.com and the reports for such rides can
be found there as well as the occasional report on the www.tvtr.co.uk
website.

If the bikes were MotoCross bikes and were not road legal then your
chances of finding the culprits are slim. I'm sure they're not going to
own up to riding illegally!

I would suggest you aim your enquiry at the following as they may know
more than we do...
http://www.cornwalltrf.org.uk/ contact Ross Fisher, Chairman, who's
e-mail address and telephone number are on their website
http://www.ktrc.org.uk This is a breakaway group from the Cornwall TRF

If you wish to ring me to discuss this please do as all of my numbers
are at the bottom of this e-mail.

Regards

Andy

-- Edited by Fixer on Wednesday 17th of February 2010 02:27:24 PM

Neil400EXC · Senior Member

Well done Andy.

Good to here the rider and horse are OK it must have been very frightening.

Lets hope they catch the stupid B**tards before they do any more damage or perhaps they'll have learned a lesson furious

Ross · Guru

From the Cornwall TRF forum

Firstly -

sorry that it has taken so long to post this but there were several things that needed to be done before it was.

Secondly -

please everyone remember that the press is not likely to report things accurately, let alone in a favourable light to us as trail riders, therefore please try to hold off on passing judgment on a newspaper article until it has been established that no more correct info is available.

Thirdly -

If anyone knows any other site on-line where this original piece has been posted please make a special effort to update it with the following post. This is really rather important as we all know that ANTIs have taken posts from trail riding sites and used them to further their own ends. (I understand that the
'incident' has made it to the TVTR and Devon web-sites - any others?)

The following has been written by a current TRF member, I think there can be no argument that this could have happened to anyone riding any lane, there can also be no doubt that Darren behaved totally appropriately in the circumstances. Darren also not only gave his details to the horse rider but also later to the group of horse riders having been with the horse rider for around 1/2 an hour.

It is to his credit that rather than let the published account of events stand he went to the police and stated what he knew to be the actual events. The police officer involved was pleased to accept his version of events and also contacted the horse rider to state this - the horse rider was apparently satisfied (and pleasently surprised) to hear from the police but did not, it seems, offer any apology to Darren for having got things a bit muddled in reporting the accident to the police (something which at the time could be excused by being in a traumatic situation).

The police officer was due to write to us, thanking us for helping deal with the accident but so far a letter has failed to turn up - I'm sure they are very busy and it will turn up eventually, but not as quickly as they seem to make assumptions about a horse and motorcycle accident perhaps.

Ref horse accident on what we call pipe lane

I am a business man in the marine trade, designing and building boats and working with people with disabilities. I personally enjoy many activities including sailing, walking, mountaineering, climbing, canoeing, adventure motorcycling and especially trail riding/green laning, which I have been doing for around 7 years now. I really enjoy this activity - getting to cruise though some of the most beautiful parts of our countryside and stopping to chat with other lane users, be they walkers, horse riders or other trail riders and we have never had any problems with anyone or an accident in all that time.
Trail riding can be enjoyed all year round, in the rain and cold as well as the heat of summer. However we choose to avoid some local byways in the summer so as not to disturb the increasing number of tourists walking on the lanes, even though there are thousands of miles of footpaths open to them that we are forbidden to use. We also try to avoid weekends in the summer, preferring shorter trips and at the end of the day though unfortunately we all have to work, which ultimately brings us out with the rest of the world on a Sunday.
As more and more of the lanes have been closed to vehicles we have not been left with a lot of areas in which we can pursue our passion, and this in turn has concentrated the number of users, as most of them are, like myself, middle aged with many calls on our time.
For me, trail riding allows me to forget the hectic week and the stresses of my business responsibilities and helps clear my mind. I love to go out and enjoy the lanes, the countryside and the challenge of trying to navigate my bike to new places, and I especially enjoy the technical aspects of trying to get up a rocky hill climb when just getting to the top can create a fantastic feeling of achievement. It also gives me a good work out so its great for keeping fit, but it also trains the mind to focus on the problem in front of you, challenging ones will to achieve.
I ride in a small group of 4-5. Most often it is 2-3, as trying to get our friends out regularly is not that easy with both work and family commitments. At 42 I am the youngest of our group. We also have two 58 and two 63 plus year olds, so we are far from young hooligans ripping up the countryside. Saying that, in full riding gear nobody would know we are a bunch of old crusties. I do notice we get much more respect from people we meet when we wear open-face helmets, but they dont protect as well from brambles and one tends to inhale a fair number of flies while trundling along, which is not that much fun.
Our rides vary from 60 to 130 miles but average out at about 90 miles a round trip, mostly around Cornwall and into Devon. Its great to see the seasonal changes - the brightness of spring, the overgrown lanes in summer, the beautiful colours of autumn and the wildness of winter. We have travelled to Wales, which was great, and have taken part in a few events which were also great fun, and we feel privileged to have been allowed ride in places that one can go without permission, as in the Cambrian rally.
Anyway, you get the background hopefully.

I am writing this about an accident my friend and myself had involving a horse and rider.
This experience shook me up and made me think more about the continuing reaction of other road users and our mutual right to enjoy the countryside; their hobby as well as ours.
We were travelling on an unmetalled track which is open to all forms of vehicles. I was following my friend at about 10m distance, traversing at 15-20 mph max as we approached a long bend near the end of the trail; where it transpired a woman on a horse had heard us coming and so tucked her and her horse into the bank. This did not make her very visible, even though she was on quite a tall brown horse. She had no Day-Glo jacket either and appeared to be in a larger group as there were further riders not too far behind.
My friend did not see her early enough or he would have stopped immediately, turned off his engine and signalled to me to stop, as this is the policy we abide by. As the rider and horse were not clearly visible by the time he saw her it was better to continue rather than risk jamming on his brakes. I witnessed this and drew to a stop and switched off my engine, by which time my friend had passed. After a brief moment the horse looked directly at me and decided he did not like the look of either me, my bike or my helmet and visor and turned around on the spot very quickly, throwing the rider. This winded her, and put her into a state of shock, which is hardly surprising considering the size of the horse. I stayed with her to make sure she was alright and soon she got up and said Why do you have to ride on the bridle way?
At this point I did not want to get into an argument about the fact it was a byway road, as she was understandably pissed off having been thrown from her horse, and the said horse running off. I offered to go and track down her horse but stayed. We then went to the end of the lane where the other riders had gathered, and I stopped and switched off my engine, as there were kids on ponies. I gave them my name and phone number and did not leave until the rider had recaptured her horse. I then stopped by the horse box to apologise again, then left.
My friend had ridden on and, seeing the other horses on the bridge, decided to go straight on. Missing all the commotion, he started wondered where I was, as it had been some time. When he returned and saw all the horses he, not knowing there had been an accident, waited at the next lane where we met up again.

What can we learn from this ????

I would hate to presume to tell riders anything, as Im not a horse rider, however I have witnessed a lot of riders over the years and they deal with other traffic in many ways. In danger areas Ive seen them dismount and lead their horses, especially when there have been young riders in their group, and this seems like a good idea.
Or, on hearing a bike on a lane they have turned around, so if the horse does bolt at least its facing the right direction. Ultimately this is down to the horse rider and the confidence they have in the particular horse and their own skill.
For all riders - either horse or bike the need for visibility is the same - get seen.
For us as trail riders, we must be as vigilant as possible and remember that there could be anything round the next corner - a horse, a child, a dog, walkers - everyone has the right to be there so keep the speed down and your eyes open.
I can only apologise to the woman involved, for ruining her days ride. It was a genuine accident which could have happened anywhere, and I write this to remind others to be careful out there, as it is not a nice experience for either party, and I hope not to experience anything like it again.

Regards,

Darren Newton

Ross · Guru

Thanks for the report Adam and thanks Darren it would have been much easier to keep your head down but you did'nt and you should be applauded for that. The rest of us we should learn a valuable lesson that because it's in the paper doesn't mean it's true and we should not be so qiuck to pass judgement.

Fixer · Tribune

I think the only judgement that was passed was based on the Policeman's e-mail to the TVTR. This turned out to be incorrect and flawed everybody's response.
So, now we know we can't trust the Police where do we stand?

Fixer · Tribune

Well done to Darren for putting the record straight. Can he get it into the local newspapers?

Withybrook · Senior Member

Fixer wrote:

I think the only judgement that was passed was based on the Policeman's e-mail to the TVTR. This turned out to be incorrect and flawed everybody's response.
So, now we know we can't trust the Police where do we stand?

TRUST and POLICE in one sentence [PUN!}

Neil400EXC · Senior Member

Well done Darren for putting the record straight. I can only apologize for my post but it was made in response to the information available at the time. I am very much against aggressive/noisy riding in the lanes as I feel it is largely responsible for the negative reactions of other users and fuels the "Antis" campaigns.
Sorry you and the young lady had what must have been a traumatic experience and hope you both can put it behind you and continue to enjoy the Lanes.
All the best,
Neil.

tomh · Guru

For what its worth i have met darren and his group on a couple of occassions, they have always struck me as sensible riders.